Using Circular 'high Nd' Filters

Elines

Elines

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I have mentioned before that I have a 10 stop ND circular filter but I have not used it because of the difficulty of focussing. The problem is that you only see a black image when you look through the view finder - because of the filter. and with my camera, even for landscapes, where you might be able to focus at infinity, this isn't at the 'end of travel'.

So the danger is that in screwing the round filter onto the front of the lens you ruin sharpness of focus. I have tried several times to find a solution to this and failed:(


I have just downloaded and read:

http://www.digitalmonochromeforum.c...rence-guide-to-long-exposure-photography.354/

which Ian posted on the Members part of the site.

AND THIS GIVES A SOLUTION:):)

You put your camera on HIGHEST ISO solely for the purposes of composition/focussing. And then (this is a direct quote from the book):

"Here’s the simple process for getting tack sharp long exposure images:

1. Switch your lens to Manual Focus

2. Turn on Live View and while mounted to a tripod

3. Select the Magnify button to toggle between 5x or 10x magnification.

4. With the focusing ring on your lens, dial in the sharpness so the edge of
your subject is as sharp as it can be."



And don't forget to switch back to desired ISO for taking the actual image:)

I have tested this and it works:)
 
good tip thanks!:)

I think, but cant confirm yet, that my camera has a simulation of exposure or something so you can see to focus but IM consumed about it all - your way seems logical and easy
 
BTW .... re simulation exposure, Graham Clark - the author - says:

"But there’s a catch. By default there’s feature called Exposure Simulation that’s turned on, which displays onscreen
what your exposure parameters are.

That’s bad, so turn that off and keep it off.

On the 6D you can turn it off in the normal settings menu; on the 5D3 it’s under custom functions as pictured here to
the right. (NOT COPIED HERE)

Once disabled you’re all set to begin composing as normal, even with 6-stop ND filters or darker."

So far as I could see my camera (550D) doesn't have this so it isn't relevant to me.
 
What a performance!

Surely the best way by far is to buy a square slot in filter and holder and bin the circular one. If you can afford a decent DSLR, lenses and the rest of the pro-am photographic paraphernalia, the outlay for a decent filter system shouldn't be too painful. If you want to do 10 stop stuff, it is a no-brainer.
 
I have always used a screw-in ND filter on my 5DmkII/17-40mm or 24-104mm lenses and never had a problem with messing up the focus so I'm not sure what trouble you guys have been having.
 
Keith Haithwaite said:
I have always used a screw-in ND filter on my 5DmkII/17-40mm or 24-104mm lenses and never had a problem with messing up the focus so I'm not sure what trouble you guys have been having.
Click to expand...

Keith

I think it is a case of different lenses being constructed in different ways (maybe):) (But please correct me if I have this wrong:))

With the kit lens of a Canon 550D if you focus the lens without the ND filter, and then screw on the filter, moving the last element of the lens alters the focus. AND the lens is not focussed at infinity (probably the most common setting with this type of filter) at the 'end of travel'. So you need a way of focusing the lens when the filter is already fitted. As you will know, the filter is so dark that you can't focus through the eyepiece in the normal way. Graham Clark, author of the 'Essential reference guide to long exposure photograph' supports my personal experience when he says:

'When using an ND filter manually focussing thorough the viewfinder is impossible.'​

Toby Webster said:
What a performance!

Surely the best way by far is to buy a square slot in filter and holder and bin the circular one. If you can afford a decent DSLR, lenses and the rest of the pro-am photographic paraphernalia, the outlay for a decent filter system shouldn't be too painful. If you want to do 10 stop stuff, it is a no-brainer.
Click to expand...

Toby

I can see why you might think that but:

  • I didn't have the benefit of reading a thread like this when I bought the filter (second hand)
  • so it wasn't until I got it that I realised that using it was more difficult than I had imagined, and I have had it for about 12 - 18 months and not previously used it with success
  • on Amazon a Cokin square nd10 filter costs about £60 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Cokin-Nuanc...458746331&sr=8-4&keywords=cokin+square+filter )
  • the filter holder costs another £12 (http://www.jessops.com/online.store/products/77741/Show.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=PLA&utm_term=P-Series Filter Holder&gclid=CIDI1cGO18sCFQWfGwod0RQK0Q )
  • and the adapter (to fit the filter holder to the lens) another £13 ( http://www.jessops.com/online.store/categories/Accessories/Lens Accessories/Cokin Filter Holder Adapters/products/Cokin/58mm P Series Adapter (P458)-14351/Show.html )
  • so I estimate the total cost of the 'square' alternative to be about £85
  • new, the B&W nd 10 circular filter is about £52 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Single-Coated-Neutral-Density-Filter/dp/B004Q3Q9OS/ref=sr_1_6?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1458746897&sr=1-6&keywords=B&W+nd10)
  • as I recall I paid about £35 for the filter, ie less than half the price of the alternative
  • in practice the method suggested by Graham Clark is quite straightforward. Being me, the main problem I have had is in remembering to change ISO back from 12500 to 100 before taking the actual shot:) You soon realise your mistake because when reviewing the image on the back of the camera all you see is a white screen:)
  • as regards "If you can afford a decent DSLR, lenses and the rest of the pro-am photographic paraphernalia, the outlay for a decent filter system shouldn't be too painful." I think my set up is probably a lot lower cost than that of most folk on here (or any other forum:)) I paid £338 for the Canon 550d (an entry level DLSR) about 3 years ago and it came with two lenses. I have since had a 'nifty fifty' (the cheapest prime lens for a Canon) for a Christmas present and a Yungnuo flash - also a Christmas present. (ie the cost of my kit is not high:))
  • so to pay 25% of the cost of the camera and two lenses for one filter that I probably wouldn't use that much isn't obviously reasonable
  • my general line is to see if I can get by with a lower cost option before spending more - and in this case I thought my strategy had failed until I saw the Graham Clark article
  • In the article (since removed from the site) Graham Clark discusses the two types of filter and says:

    "The downside to having a square ND filter is simple: light leak is the enemy
    when it comes to long exposure photography and the GND holders often allow
    small amounts of light in.

    They’re also expensive, require a holder and are cumbersome to carry around.

    My personal recommendation is to only buy circular NDs and square GNDs."​
  • So I don't think it is a 'no brainer'
Having said all that, I now have access to some square filters (see http://www.digitalmonochromeforum.co.uk/threads/filters.447/) so I hope at some point to have experience of using square filters in a holder and that may change my views:).
 
I take your point on the costs Chris. My camera body cost some £700-£800, 3 years since then and by two models superceded, it would cost me about £200 if I bought it today. I paid £500 for a lens that subsequently cost me almost the same again to repair (the focus was off) and it now needs doing again. I am not the best to make judgement on the costs of this hobby!

However, a 10 stopper a screw-in filter would drive me bonkers. There is a bit of a heavy outlay for the slide-in kit and the filter, but if you do any amount of long-exposure work, I would say its an absolute must. Unless, of course, you have much more patience than me, and I strongly suspect that you do.

Oh, and I have never had a light leak.
 
Elines said:
Keith

I think it is a case of different lenses being constructed in different ways (maybe):) (But please correct me if I have this wrong:))
Click to expand...

I think that is the answer Chris, the two lenses I mentioned are rock solid and don't move when screwing a filter on or off.
 
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